Fashion Futures and The Trap of Novelty with Clarice Garcia | Think Forward Show 147

Trends aren’t just a fashion problem. They’re a system for manufacturing novelty, and right now that system is running at TikTok speed. I sit down with Clarice Garcia, a futurist and designer who moved from architecture in Brazil to studying fashion in Milan, only to realize the real story isn’t clothing at all. The story is the logic behind “new,” and what that logic does to sustainability, culture, and our sense of belonging.

We get specific about how trend forecasting works in the fashion industry, why it becomes a worst-case scenario for sustainable consumption, and how microtrends shorten the life span of taste from months to days. We also unpack the luxury contradiction: brands that talk about sustainability while destroying unsold inventory to protect scarcity and symbolic value. That tension forces a bigger question: if we don’t change what luxury and status mean, how can the system ever change?

Clarice then walks me through fashion futuring, her speculative design and futures thinking toolkit built to spark imagination and provoke a values-driven transition toward sustainability. The method uses fiction to create artifacts and narratives, then extracts the values inside them and turns those values into action through backcasting. We explore how the same “fashion logic” shows up in electronics, automotive, and cosmetics, and why values-centered work can reveal real pathways beyond greenwashing and futures theater.

If you care about sustainable fashion, design fiction, systems change, or values-driven innovation, this conversation will stretch your thinking. Subscribe, share this with a friend who loves “the new,” and leave a review with the value you think your industry should put first.

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Thank you for joining me on this ongoing journey into the future. Until next time, stay curious, and always think forward.

Transcript

What “Fashion Futures” Really Means

SPEAKER_01 0:00

So fashion futures. I remember when I first saw that that you were talking about it, I was like, is it futures for the fashion industry or like futures for and it's got so much more layers to it? And as I as you kind of put your work out to sh you know share with the world, I found it a fascinating space.

SPEAKER_00 0:16

Actually, I have a bachelor's in architecture. Then when I finished it, I I left Brazil and I went to Milan and I lived there for uh to to go to study fashion, uh fashion design. But then it was interesting because like very soon uh I realized that I was not that interested in fashion design per se, but I was more interested in uh in what is like the logic behind it.

SPEAKER_01 0:42

Clarice, welcome to Think Forward.

SPEAKER_00 0:45

Thank you. My pleasure. Thanks for having me, Steve.

SPEAKER_01 0:49

It's so great to have you here. So fashion futures. I remember when I first saw that, that you were talking about it, I was like, is it futures for the fashion industry or like futures for and it's got so much more layers to it. And as I as you kind of put your work out to you know share with the world, I found it a fascinating space. Um and you come from, well, fashion design, so it's best that I let you tell the story. So I guess the best place to go is the Milan years, we should call it your the origin story, as all superheroes have.

SPEAKER_00 1:20

Yeah, definitely. Sure.

SPEAKER_01 1:22

Yeah.

From Architecture To Milan Fashion

SPEAKER_00 1:23

Actually, I have a bachelor's in architecture. Then when I finished it, I I left Brazil and I went to Milan and I lived there for uh to to go to study fashion, uh fashion design. But then it was interesting because like very soon uh I realized that I was not that interested in fashion design per se, but I was more interested in uh in what is like the logic behind it, and also uh as an architect, and you know, like I I've been also very curious about people and behaviors and about connecting the dots of other forms of arts as well, such as cinema, design, uh furniture, and politics, and you know, and everything that could be kind of forming us as a humanity. And I think that fashion is just an expression of it. That's why maybe I was that interested as a designer. Yeah, just kind of then I changed to a trend forecasting postgraduate course, which was my first step into futures thinking.

How Trend Forecasting Runs Fashion

SPEAKER_01 2:28

So trend forecasting. So a lot of people you can call it trend hunting. What exactly how do you define it? So that people kind of get a grounding, like what is it generally, and like how do you do you have a certain perspective or techniques that you like in order to find the trends beyond this, you know, signals?

SPEAKER_00 2:46

Sure. I guess like the fashion industry has a very systematic way to work with trends. So for the audience that is like probably formed also by other foresight practitioners, we have the trend forecasting as a practice uh in economics, for example, which is pretty much informed by data. But in fashion, uh, trend forecasting is a tool that orchestrates all the production of goods that the fashion industry has and made available for the public for consumption, um, in a manner that it avoids economic loss, financial loss. So it basically starts with color forecasting and then it informs the textile industry that produces the textiles, the materials, and then like from the designers, choose the materials and then you start looking at the shapes and et cetera. But what trend forecasting basically does is kind of to orchestrate everything and prevent the industry to have a

Fast Fashion Meets TikTok Speed

SPEAKER_00 3:44

financial loss.

SPEAKER_01 3:44

You called it the where uh call, prep or prep call, you called it the worst case scenario for sustainability. Where did the where did you first feel that the tension for that?

SPEAKER_00 3:57

Where the I think that it's been always very pro problematic, the fashion industry, in a sense that fashion is not formed only by clothes, but it's formed by this sense of novelty, right? So what makes fashion fashion is this idea that we'll see a change very soon. And then that thing that you bought before will not make sense in two or three months, because not because it doesn't fit you, basically, but because it doesn't suit your taste anymore. So it's based on like changing tastes and having this sense of novelty that is completely accelerated today at levels that are just not sustainable at all. So when I started, when I went to Milan to study fashion, it was more than 20 years ago. And we had a completely different scenario as well in terms of industry and in terms of the world as well. Although it was like still unsustainable, we had started to have like uh fast fashion chains like uh, you know, like in the 90s. So it wasn't that bad as it is today. Um and I guess today the trends they are just changing, not even like seasonally, but they are changing faster than that. With TikTok trends and also with the capacity that the industry has to produce garments and accessories in a week, then it's just become um too unsustainable at a point that there is no return. We we really need to rethink and reimagine fashion as a system uh and reimagine it through cultural lenses as well, not just from the material aspect of it. So it's not just about sustainable products or green products, it's about rethinking the culture behind it.

SPEAKER_01 5:47

Well, you had you had mentioned there's also things out there like TikTok outfit challenges, live stream catwalks. Obviously, this is a space I do not inhabit. But like influencers, you know, these mic, they're like micro trends. They're like they have a half-life of days and weeks. And do you think we passed a point of no return? I mean, I worry about it even getting faster because it seems like that's always this push. It's like a cognitive dissonance that's happening, like the visceral feeling of the differences, you know, in in time and feeling the change. But do you think that we can keep up like and still be responsible?

SPEAKER_00 6:21

Look, I think that's a very good question, in a sense that That's what I'm here for.

SPEAKER_01 6:26

That's what I'm here for.

SPEAKER_00 6:30

Yes.

SPEAKER_01 6:30

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 6:31

No, because you know, uh fashion is very much and has always been very much tied to communication. Right. So also like the way the trends are spread out is actually one of the big drivers of how the fashion industry works as a system. So considering how social media is going today, uh, I think that we really have a big problem ahead. I don't think that social media is going to slow down as a big player in this in this uh in this structure. And I think that I don't see as well when we look at the data and the and research about Generation Z, for example, who are young people, they are very heavily consuming uh fast-fashioned goods. So they are kind of a little bit abandoning uh the uh instincts for sustainability uh in the name of appearance and in the name of belonging to the groups, you know, and and how they look like, which is again a cultural problem that is bigger than fashion as a problem as an industry. So yeah, it's it's a it's a societal uh problem, maybe, and that is very much tied to communication channels and media channels, uh, such as TikTok. The good side is that, you know, now we at least we don't need to kind of just obey and rely on what experts say. It's more democratic in the sense. However, it just became faster and with more trends as opposed to just like really democratic as, you know, as a system.

Burning Inventory And Fake Sustainability

SPEAKER_01 8:09

Well, with the regards to the system, you know, I think of the manufacturers. I had mentioned they saw the show, a French TV show. I'm not that, you know, fancy or highbrow, but it was fascinating. It's called Les Maisons, and it was also trying to learn, you know, working on my French, but they talked about they were basically like two fictional luxury brands, like you know, in Paris, and they would destroy the unsold inventory or they would have it away. The the up-and-coming person that you're introduced to this world is trying to use recycled materials, but it they do that to preser I was like shocked. Like they do it to preserve brand value because of obviously fakes or things that are on second markets. It it kind of stops people cold when you think of most people don't know that's happening, but what do you think, you know, the symbolic versus it it kind of kind of encompasses the symbolic and the material value, right? And it's also the meaning of scarcity and the physical reality of the waste. Like, so what do you think this kind of approach kind of what do you think it costs us? I mean, especially with from the system, from trying to redefine the

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SPEAKER_01 9:19

system.

SPEAKER_00 9:49

Definitely, and I think that's uh that's one of the biggest examples of like how the fashion

(Cont.) Burning Inventory And Fake Sustainability

SPEAKER_00 9:57

industry is just like the worst case scenario because it's not just about accelerating trends, but it's about yeah trying to keep this sense of novelty and exclusivity as as assets uh to drive consumption, right? Um and when we see like this uh you know this uh type of you know action that is like burning unsold stocks just to not devalue the symbolic um the symbolic uh value of the of the of the brand, I guess we can still see how the fashion industry has has been claiming to be more sustainable. And if you go into any website of those brands, you see that they have the you know the manifesto or the commitment with sustainability. However, they do not commit 100%. And they are still you know doing lots of greenwashing initiatives because the roots of this system, they are not changing, which is again about culture. So going on sales, having luxury goods going on sales, it's not something that happens just because of the symbolic value of the brand. And so, how do we, you know, how do we change how people see luxury? What is luxury from a cultural perspective? Maybe that's the the point that fashion featuring, the methodology that created, is aiming for. It's kind of to make us rethink what new meanings those aspects of the fashion industry could assume. And therefore, if we change those meanings in culture, then what happens with this system? Because if we still have culturally this vision that to be a luxury brand or a luxury product, it has to be with the same parameters that we had a hundred years ago. It's we are not going anywhere. We really need to rethink the system from within and widely.

SPEAKER_01 12:05

Well, let's let's unpack the concept. So we've talked about it with fashion futures, and it was your PhD work, you know, which is unto itself, you know,

Defining The Fashion Futuring Toolkit

SPEAKER_01 12:13

a challenge, right? But it was practice-based. So you use that as a way to, I think, experiment and test things in a safer place than would be like a client setting. So I want the listeners to kind of really fully get this. And, you know, because obviously I say like it sounds like about like clothing or even just the fashion industry itself, but it's not. And so how do you explain it to people who've never encountered this?

unknown 12:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 12:38

It's kind of the reframe of it. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:40

Sure. So fashion featuring is actually like a speculative methodology that's materialized into a toolkit that was created to spark imagination and provoke a values-driven transition uh in the systems towards sustainability. So it's not about creating fancy fictional artifacts, but it is actually a methodology that uses fiction as a medium for imagination and for like systemic transition. So it actually articulates reality and fiction and also materiality and abstraction as complementary sides of the same coin. And it helps stakeholders to imagine new meanings for fashion and also uh new values for fashion in the future. So it's kind of um a practice uh and a methodology that is kind of based on the idea of transform transformative foresight as well. So it's not no, it's not just about expanding trends or extending the present realities into the future, but it's it's like it's really created for us to rethink what matters to us and how we can really reimagine those systems under new under a new set of values. I think that's it.

SPEAKER_01 13:57

And you and you've mentioned that it can apply to let's take like a couple areas like electronics or automotive,

Applying Fashion Logic Beyond Clothing

SPEAKER_01 14:05

cosmetics, furniture. Just to name a few, right? It's the practice you had is it's kind of taking you all over. So let's take one of those and like walk me through what it like looks like in practice for that industry. Like let's look at something like, yeah. Sure. Your choice. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 14:23

Yeah, that just like, yeah, just like as I said before, uh, this fashion is not necessarily about clothing, but fashion is the lot this logic of change, right? And it's pretty much based on the sense of novelty. So imagine, for example, color palettes for iPhones or for you know smartphones. So when we look at like new phones in the market, going into the market, they go early into the market and they change, and they have like different color palettes that give that phone sometimes like that sense of novelty that is even more important than the features that that product has in terms of new cameras or you know, new technology involved, et cetera. So many times we see people critiquing, I don't know, new new the new iPhone because it's not necessarily that different from the previous one. However, when they change the colors, they make the product feel new again. So that's the same logic that we have in fashion. It's just a cure once a year. So in this case, the toolkit could be adaptable to the people that are imagining those products in, for example, in electronics. And in electronics, this idea of like the aesthetic is pretty much like this big, big driver for consumption and novelty and the fashion sense of the object. And so we could kind of adapt the toolkit to have those people involved in that industry to rethink if we don't change the colors as a driver for consumption. So what else could we be doing? And also if our industry is more than just making profit, if it has to be regenerative somehow, if it can give something back to nature, for example, how can we give it, how can we rethink that based on the product and portfolio that we offer to our consumers? So a business is always way more than just like the product itself, and it's about the narratives they build, it's about all the initiatives they have for society that are not just like mere philanthropy, but how can they really change the manner they see their own business from within if they consider new values for the business? An example would be, for example, Patagonia is a business, a fashion business, but it was built upon values that are not just profit. So Patagonia as a brand, it has like in its core values that are made that made the entire business to be as it is. And that's the that's what fashion featuring aims to do, is kind of to help those stakeholders that already have a business at any scale to rethink, okay, these values that we had as a brand before worked so far. However, we need to transition our systems and our brands into a future that is possible for us as humanity to thrive and live. So if that's the case, how can we reimagine the values for our brand and rethink these strategies to get there?

SPEAKER_01 17:30

It's you know, you mentioned uh a number of things in this, in that explanation. I I and it made me think, like,

From Fiction To Backcasting Action

SPEAKER_01 17:38

see the iPhone, for example, there's many user personas, customer profiles. I'm a person that uh yeah, there's a lot of people that just want the one every year and they just want a constant because they want the newest thing, right? That's I skip like four generations usually just to kind of get the life out of the phone, but then it's like there's a time. But like the newest one that I have is there's choices of orange or like navy or like something, but it was like I have the orange one, but it felt like a completely different felt, like a new, you know. So it you're definitely there. And I think about automotive like BMW, you know, they have or any manufacturer, any design, like they have a whole new design spec that's introducing the electric cars, and every that every four or five years kind of resets the what is new. And when you look at older cars, I mean you can look back and think of the same thing, and there's things that are retained to kind of main like the they call the kidneys on a BMW, like the front grille, to maintain that that's a BMW, but at the same time, there's changes in that to make it feel different because it's like and it it's funny because it thinks it makes me think about Henry Ford's like you can have any car as long as it's black, like it was, you know, the you know, over a hundred years ago it was just the move to the manufacturing, now it's the move to this customization, but at the expense of what? You know, and you say it's like it's not just about imagining the futures, right? It's about bridging the imagination and the action itself. You know, I know that you know, things like Stuart Candy's thing from the future, which is great, you know, we both love it, but it's kind of stops at a certain place. And yours kind of follows on from that. It's kind of the what of like all right, so what do we do? Right? How did what moment did it kind of you know, you always stand on you always build things on the shoulders of others, right? That and those are those are compliments to the person that created the thing in the first place. So where did it come for you that you you saw that it was that next step, like you needed to build this next step?

SPEAKER_00 19:47

Mm-hmm. Yeah, um, my PhD was a practice-based one. So I started creating the twos and my reflections, they they you know, they came through uh applying those those twos, like with people in workshops, so on and so forth. And so I started pretty much with like very few differences from the student candy's approach or other two kids' approaches. And at the end of those workshops, I had like every time I had like this comment somehow that it was like it was very fun and playful and we loved it. However, what do we do with that? How do we go from here to a change, right? And then I started to feel that actually participants feel frustrated because, and instead of giving them like a sort of hope for better futures through speculative design or design fiction, we were actually kind of doing the opposite because they, you know, they left the workshops feeling frustrated and demotivated somehow, you know. It's like, okay, that's the max we can do. So why doing that? And so I I yeah, and so I started to think, okay, like this is just one step, which is imagining, which is a big step that, for example, the thing from the future does beautifully, which is helping people to imagine things, which is amazing. However, my thoughts were, okay, how can we connect this with transitions and with change? And then I just connected that stage of imagination with unpacking the imagination of the object into values and then setting those values as a central, central part of systemic transition into a backcasting activity, which is pretty much recognized as one of our more solid tools that we have in foresight.

SPEAKER_01 21:37

That's true. That's so when you have teams do this, and I like to differentiate between, you know, the real work versus like I call it foresight theater, futures theater, you know, going through the motions. What does it look like when a team's really using this really well? Like what does it look like when success is there?

SPEAKER_00 22:00

Yeah, I think that when they use it really well is number one, when they unleash their imagination. They really embrace fiction as a strategy. And facilitators have a big role in this because it's the facilitator's role to explain and to keep people engaged and to also jump in with them into those fictional scenarios and stories and artifacts. So I think that the first step to have success is to really embrace fiction, not just as A waste of time, but as a strategy for imagining otherwise. The second thing I think that is kind of dedicating some time after creating the stories, the narratives, and the artifacts, is like having the teams, multidisciplinary teams, so different stakeholders in the process involved discussing what values are embedded in those objects and stories that they discussed through fiction, right? Because this is a very, very important step. It's kind of difficult to discuss values and to really find what values we are, we want to say when we chose that story. Maybe the first value that comes to mind is protection, but maybe it's not protection, it's something a little bit more nuanced. And so dedicating some time to this discussion is important. And finally, I guess it's kind of having people from different points of the system working together in the first bit of the workshop, which is like the fictional stage and the values discovery, to then separate them into things that are more focused on just one aspect of the system to have them imagining the transitions because they are the experts, so they they'll have like, you know, the expertise to imagine transitions based on the values discussed with everyone. Have like one stage where all the stakeholders are mixed together to find the fictional stories and the values. And then in a second stage where we go into the backcasting activity, then we reorganize the teams in a manner that you have teams with expertise in one part of the sector to reimagine it. So, for example, we have like the people in the textiles industry, instead of being mixed with people from manufacturing and marketing and design, they will be again together as textiles experts to reimagine and redefine that part of the sector based on the values that everyone uh unpacked together.

SPEAKER_01 24:26

You know, as a design futurist myself, you know, I've always believed that the future has to be tangible. You have to be able to touch it, taste it, feel it, see it. It's a way and just beyond the scenario, right? It's it's like the that that action, the understanding of of how to actually take action on it. Is that your experience as well with us?

SPEAKER_00 24:49

Yeah, 100%. And I think that, you know, if we cannot

Values First And Leadership Reality

SPEAKER_00 24:53

feel that somehow, if we cannot feel the future going into a better direction, how you know, how can we have like, you know, the grid and the and uh hope to change it? And I think that design has this beautiful like um aspect of like, you know, um allowing people to to see this future somehow, to imagine it and to materialize it somehow. So yeah, I totally agree with you. I think that we need some sort of sensing the the future that design can help us to what what do you think breaks down when we I have my obviously my own opinions.

SPEAKER_01 25:32

What do you think breaks down when you try and do it? Like how do and and what you're doing right now, like kind of holding things together as as people go through it, is a a better chemistry, better binding agent. Well, what breaks down when you try and do it?

SPEAKER_00 25:49

I think that the values are at the center of everything, right? So when the stakeholders are together, if we keep in mind that even if they have different agendas, they in different, you know, expertise, if they if they really concentrate their attention into the values, into the shared values, I think that's where it's where the magic happens.

SPEAKER_01 26:11

Love it. You know, and you use this phrase, uh, I pronounce it right paradigmatic transformation. You know, it's like what I love about you say it like this, because everyone's always about the 10-year um horizon or the forecast, like what do we do in the next 10 years? It's like, you know, what are the values we build in the future's work? Like, given that the planet's kind of a crisis in so many different ways these days. You know, like you said, when you do you do you find them responsive when they put the values at the center instead of the strategy? Do you find them responsive in that? Like, how do you find them does it does it test them that it's not just a words on the website?

SPEAKER_00 26:52

Yeah, I think that's a big, big, big uh challenge that we have, which is like how do people how do people commit with what they really believe and trust and want versus the big machine that is kind of trapping us somehow, right? So what I can see uh like over the years, like during my practice, is that it's not that people in those companies and organizations they don't want to change. Otherwise, I think that all people recognize that we have a big problem that then we need to change. The problem goes with like how do we sustain our change if the leadership is not willing to, you know, see things differently and is just committed with profit. And I think that's where that's where we really kind of stop about like really doing those transitions, which is like there is a personal value, there is a shared value when we are imagining desirable futures, but then when it comes to reality, no one really, like a few people has really the capacity to really go against this kind of machine and propose something new. And I think that probably one of the reasons for that, and I think that this is probably one of the benefits of fashion featuring, is that in many, in many activities that, particularly those that involve imagination, people tend to imagine things that just disappear. For example, no, so let's imagine a world where fashion doesn't exist. No, no, no, it does, and it will be existing for the next 100 years at least, I can assure you. So imagining those, you know, those futures erasing things that cannot be erased right now is useless from my perspective. I think that what we need to invite people doing is the opposite, is kind of this is not just an exercise of imagination. This system is going to exist for the next 100 years. However, if we go in this path and in this way, we will be your next generations, our next generations will be living in a very worst, uh worst uh planet. Therefore, is that what we want? So, how can we commit with this change that is not just about us, but that maybe the effects could be seen just by your, you know, your kids in the future. And then I guess having like also something to help people to think that it's not going to disappear. The problem is not going to disappear. And we really need to invest time and effort in changing it. There is no other way. There's no other route. That's the only route. The problem is how fast are you doing that now or later? What is the intensity you are putting in these transformations? Is it now or later? And I think it comes with awareness and consciousness of people that there is no other way of doing a fashion future or any future of any kind of industry unless we look at sustainability in a serious manner.

SPEAKER_01 30:12

Sulture, for example. Like you've worked, you live in Australia right now, you're Italian. And there's also what's that? I'm

Culture, Local Context, And Adaptation

SPEAKER_01 30:20

Brazilian. I'm Brazilian, I'm sorry. I apologize. Yeah, yeah. That's right. So but you've worked also in Italy in Minwala, and you want to, you know, and then you've also worked in the worked with the companies in the United States. Like, how does thing how do things play out differently across these kind of contexts? Like, do you need to adapt or is this kind of universal? Does it help? Is there another layer to this because of the systems?

SPEAKER_00 30:46

There is definitely many layers when we apply those methodologies in different places. And I think that it's not just a matter of fashion featuring, but also other methodologies, right? Um, I think that one thing that should be done is to have like a facilitator that is from that place that is like helping you, because as we are talking about culture, you might lose some insights and some nuances in those discussions. This is one thing that needs to be done. However, although like the fashion featuring was created to be an universal toolkit, I'm also very much aware that it like we should, as futurists and designers, we should be creating more tailored versions of what we do. Uh, and considering, you know, like the aspects of the place uh and the localities and those kind of dynamics and nuances that that we cannot, you know, not universal. Um and I think that what happens with fashion featuring is it somehow needs to be universal because the fashion featuring is pretty much global and it's pretty much connected. However, what is interesting to see in different places is that for people in different places, the values that come up are also different, and they are pretty much related to the place they are in the place they come from. So I think that's where things change naturally in the fashion featuring tool. However, one thing that is good to add to the fashion featuring is kind of also discussions about their own realities, and it can happen through the backcasting stage of the process. But definitely, I don't think we should have universal toolkits. I think we should we need to adapt them a bit to the realities that we have.

SPEAKER_01 32:36

Yeah, and it's like so this leads me to the toolkit itself, which we put in the show link. So it's on your website. There's a bunch of cards. I think are you

Getting The Toolkit And Hacking It

SPEAKER_01 32:44

you're working on some other physical, I think, parts of it as well. And there's a whole I'll put the QR code in the video here. So for somebody who wants to start experimenting with this, where where would they where do they start?

SPEAKER_00 32:56

Yeah, they should uh go into the fashion featuring website. And then when you go there, you see that the boards are available, but not the cards. So you just have to hit the button of like get in touch, uh, have a hard copy or something like that. And then you will mail me and I can I can be in touch, like to to give the cards and also the manual of instructions that is also available. So like all the methodology is pretty much explained across the boards, uh the supportive boards that we have for the for the workshop, but also the manual. Um, and one thing that that is also on the website is kind of you can do your own fashion featuring toolkit, you know, in a sense that it it's formed by images as provocations for imagination. It's formed by, you know, different types of artifacts like shoes, a coat, a jacket, uh, you know, a backpack, whatever. And it's formed by these systems. And what I encourage people doing is like even if you get the templates, you can adapt them to your own reality. It doesn't have to be the way I envision it. Otherwise, it's it's it's a toolkit that is inviting people to hack it and to really change it. For example, the images that I selected for the for the cards, they are based on my vision, on my own references. But what if a person in South Africa decides to add more images to those cards? It's spectacular because every every culture, every every person has a different, a different view, a different taste, a different perception of what images could be, for example, in a toolkit. And I would love to see more variety and diversity in that in that toolkit. So I consider the fashion featuring actually a sort of template that people could just like have.

SPEAKER_01 34:50

Definitely usually use Instagram, get people to like put their own, you know, create some type of tagging, you know, technique for people to share and uh see each other's concepts. That's great. It's great. So like, you know, we've talked a lot about different industries. What do you think it's something, you know, being a trend, trend hunter, trend follower, trend gatherer? What do

Beauty Culture As A Major Distraction

SPEAKER_01 35:13

you think is something that everyone is uh watching, but you think is a distraction?

SPEAKER_00 35:20

I think that all the things related to beauty, I think that it has become a big distraction. In a sense that we are just so captured by the idea of performing online and being beautiful and being handsome and their skincare and the makeups and you know, the plastic surgeries, whatever, that I think that it's just became the the biggest distraction ever in Western societies.

SPEAKER_01 35:49

So what the flip it? So what do you think nobody's watching? Like do you think it's gonna matter, like in a big way?

SPEAKER_00 35:56

Yeah, I think that, well, everyone is kind of watching everything nowadays. One thing that I think is it's true, right? It's just like, but one thing that I think is still pretty niche in academia and has a big potential for humanity is like the concept of uh modern human design or life design uh concept instead of human-centered design that was a concept you know spread out in the 2000s by IDO. Uh so like how can we reimagine the planet and the things that we design, systems, objects, communication, whatever we do using the lens of modern human as opposed to human-centered. I think that this is a beautiful thing that should get more traction.

SPEAKER_01 36:42

So, industry-wise, we've talked about a lot of industries that have used this, you've worked with. There's one out there that you so like they have I really want them to adopt it. Which one would that be?

SPEAKER_00 36:54

I think that the beauty industry.

SPEAKER_01 36:56

Beauty industry.

SPEAKER_00 36:58

Beauty, yeah. The amount of products they have is insane. It's just, and it's like a forever thing. And the number of different, you know, it's like for eyelashes, like lipsticks and color, different colors and different textures and different it's just insane. And I think that's one of the most problematic industries. Maybe they don't have like all the impact in terms of uh disposability that that clothing has, but it has like huge impact in mental health as well of people. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 37:33

So uh on a on a fun note, like I always think about the things that influence us. I think about books like you know, that I've read. In your journey being a futurist and coming to this work, what what changed how you see the

Books, Legacy, And Where To Connect

SPEAKER_01 37:46

future? Is there a book out there that you you you read that helped like kind of make you go, make you step back or kind of flip your worldview?

SPEAKER_00 37:56

Yeah, I think that actually my PhD changed the way I see the future. But it's just a little journey for everyone, right? So it's not the best one. But I think that I read a book once that is called Um Design Futuring, uh from Tony Fry, um who is the author. And I think that it changed everything for me in terms of like in terms of the concept of design, the concept of what we do as as you know, as as humans in the in the objects and and things that we build and that we put in the world, and it changed a lot about how I see the future and how I see our, particularly how how I see our action in the present towards the future. Because it brings that concept of the futuring, right? Which is like if we like the it's like the commitment the design today as a big, big kind of system has with like the futuring, which is like deteriorating the capacity of us to have flourishing futures, because like all the products and things, they are designed to kind of just for consumption and you know they're not designed for sustainability, for example.

SPEAKER_01 39:11

Great. Now, okay, as we kind of wrap things, I always like that I ask the legacy question. So you have a long career ahead of you, but you have a lot of things you've already accomplished too. Like if you're kind of you know sitting in mil in a cafe in Milan and you're thinking about a great career behind you, like what would you want the world to see as your contribution, your legacy, like the things you want to bring to this, to the to your work, to the field?

SPEAKER_00 39:39

I think that is kind of this idea that for us to kind of even in even in times of AI, it's like this idea of how can we really get back to us as human beings and reassess what values for us as humanity, as a collective, instead of just as individuals, uh, and how these values they may affect not just us as a generation, but the next generations as well. So I guess like what I'd love to you know to give back to the world is this idea of how can we also question more the status quo instead of just continue in the same road? How can we deviate? How can we stop and rethink and refresh and repurpose not just products but ideas? So I think that's what I'd love for people to have from me and from my work.

SPEAKER_01 40:36

That's a great uh great sentiment. So people want to find you. Obviously, we'll put links in there, but people want to see more about your work and obviously fashion futures. Where would they go?

SPEAKER_00 40:48

So they can go into the fashion featuring website, which is www.fashionfuturing at the end.com, or they can find me on LinkedIn. My LinkedIn is Clarice Garcia, and yeah, and they can email me if they want to uh directly. So my email is Garcia Clarice at gmail.com.

SPEAKER_01 41:13

Great. Well, it's been a pleasure having you on. Um just uh we'll have to have you back. I'm curious to dive into more of it myself, and I I love the work and thank you for taking the time to share it with me and the rest of our the listeners here on the show.

SPEAKER_00 41:29

My pleasure, Stephen. It was a great conversation. Thanks for having me.

SPEAKER_01 41:33

Great, thanks.

SPEAKER_00 41:35

Thanks for listening to the Think Forward Podcast.

SPEAKER_01 41:38

You can find us on all the major podcast platforms and at www.thinkforwardshow.com as well as on YouTube under Think Forward Show. See you next time.